[mrhood]

Its not very encouraging to start playing tank in hard modes.
For every class a pug accept undergeared toons, except for the tank.
Some pugs u almost have to be fully geared before u can join them as a tank or people just get angry at you.

However if dps was better geared or healer, the boss would die faster, or tank more healed.

[Nolenthar]

Originally Posted by mrhood Its not very encouraging to start playing tank in hard modes. For every class a pug accept undergeared toons, except for the tank. Some pugs u almost have to be fully geared before u can join them as a tank or people just get angry at you. However if dps was better geared or healer, the boss would die faster, or tank more healed.

Exactly, and asking over geared tank for KK HM is just plain silly, you can go there with an city armor set and do just fine

Of course, undergeared tank to solo Flame or Coppice HM, it's another issue

[haroldthecimmeri]

I loved playing this game up till Level 80 and also enjoyed the faction quests. I have my own tiger and wolf mounts. However, I am at a loss when it comes to faction gear. They seem to require Rare Tokens which you can ONLY get in raids/group dungeons.

Trouble is, last time I played a raid, my laptop crashed. Also, I don't have 2-3 hours to set aside in one go. I therefor play solo most of the time. Does this mean I will never get faction items because I will never get RTs?

If so, I may as well call it a day and stop playing. Either that or start a new character.

Pity, 'cos apart from the inflexibility of faction gear needing RTs, it's a good game.

[marlasca]

You can get Rare Trophy tokens in two solo encounters in Khitai/Turan, 1) Refuge of the Apostate in KK, and 2) Isle of Iron Statues in Turan.

The first gives 2-3 rares per run, Isle gives 2-3 rares in NM and 2x 2-3 rares in HM. So if you are lucky you can get as much as 9 rares from those 2, or as I usually do nowadays, 6... (yes, in HM!) :/

Anyhow... getting Rare Trophy tokens in Khitai does not require that you raid 2-3 hours. You need to join hard mode groups (HM, you will see in /Global or /LFG) to various dungeons in Northern Grasslands, Chosain, Kara Korum or Paikang - of course subject to certain AA skill requirements.
You will find anything from a very simple dungeon like Palace of Yun Rau taking you 10 minutes to get you 3 rares and the chance of some epic Khitai piece (check Aoc Armory by Kentarii from complete list of dungeon drops), and most "popular" are the KK HM runs which includes Celestial Necropolis, Cavern of Malice and Enigmata of Yag (up until 3.1 the only place that dropped the epic Khitai leg pieces). Those usually last 1-1.30 hours depending on how pro your group is.

So, you see, no need for lengthy raiding, and you can solo it to a piece but of course it could require doing so very long.. add some simple group dungeons and it will be quicker.

[Pariah]

Originally Posted by haroldthecimmeri However, I am at a loss when it comes to faction gear. They seem to require Rare Tokens which you can ONLY get in raids/group dungeons.

Faction gear consists of four ranks, and is acquired through three different methods: Solo play, loot from dungeons and buyable with tokens from dungeons. Rare trophies lets you buy two pieces (chest+helm) of epic gear (rank 4). The complete distribution of gear can be found here.

It is possible to trade between the three lowest tokens and the solo-tokens, which lets you gear up with mostly rank 3/4 by playing solo. As others mentioned you can get a few rare trophies a day from solo dungeons, but the most effective way is 6-man dungeons. Raids do not give you any rare trophies.

[Misiuggah]

You only need rares for 2 epic armor pieces - 4 you have to drop in HMs and 2 you have to buy with Marks of Acclaim (round green tokens with square hole - gained by doing faction quests).

Assuming you will run Refuge and Isle everyday, it will take you about 60 days to get epic chest and helm. But still you need to run HMs to get hands, legs, shoulder and belt.

You don't need to raid at all - faction stuff is a totally different thing. Your rig should handle 6-man instances and that's the only thing you need to gear up in epics.

A standard KK run (Cavern of Malice, Celestial Necropolis, Enigmata of Yag) takes about 1,5h to complete and you can get 10-14 rares plus a chance to get a few epics.

This is not a single-player game - you must get some friends, people who will help you reach your goals. The quality of the game will improve by a lot.

[purplet86]

owever if dps was better geared or healer, the boss would die faster, or tank more healed.

Theres not much bonus healing from equipment, healrating is giving some bonus but its not enough to keep a bad tank alive.
The problem with tank aint the equipment, with some t1, t2 and khitai blues (u dont need critigation) AND the right feats (dmg dt with blues simply cannot tank as i had to see on my dt toon while with a defensive specc the grp has to w8 with the dps but the dt can survive)-
=>In 99/100cases the tank with bad equipment is bad at playing too and sry i dont want guys who cant play the instances in a pug for some quick hm, thats what guilds are for!
I know 2players who know the instances but have a guard only to help out (one with that blue lvl80, not culture, set with lots of protection) but they can tank the easy hms without problem and i know more with epics from t2 grinding who cant do it.

[jauertussen]

Originally Posted by Melekaiah it is a VERY long haul to get those hundreds of rares.. i have now saved up 400 total. and i am so sick of rare farming i wanna puke :P. but i still have at least 500 rares to farm.not to mention actually doing hardmodes for the rest with random drops. blah

have to qoute this seems u belive, u need to farm kk for getting gear for other instances for drops... realy a wieard way of seeing it. u dont requiere khitai gear to do hm. just do em all at get drops as u go. one thing is using time to farm rares. but then afterwuds start to farm other instances for certain drops is stupid. howabout....... farm the instances u want gear from. like do 3-4 over until u get the gear, then move along. and when u finished getting gear look how many rares u miss??

[jauertussen]

Originally Posted by Rathothis That's exactly the point. Yes, it is hard to gear up your tank in PUGs. Unlike a run with guildies or friends, a PUG mostly is a means to an end, and the end is rare tokens. So while most PUGs don't mind having an undergeared rogue or mage around, most will not be happy to bring a blue geared tank and watch Zhu La take huge chunks out of his health bar. The best advice to people who want to give tanking a go, then, is to find a couple of friends who do dungeons for fun, rather than for rewards. Having a group that understands that you are undergeared, and is willing to "invest" in your progress, generally works wonders. By way of contrast, if you are tired of waiting for the uber epic endgame tank to join your PUG, consider "investing" in a friend who has an interest in playing a soldier. There are plenty of people around who would like to tank, just give them the benefit of doubt and don't give up after the first few wipes.

jup god point. but agein a weak tank is not always a problem. if ppl play realy smart with other classes and support the tank, with coordinated buffs. like bs prot thing and necro prot ****, and agro pet. or sin taking agro and bubble or spec ure barb so he can offtank. and in the end if u play ure tank realy well skill can often compencede for gear in some situations. but then agein the guy with a undergeared tank issent the player with 2 years exp with hes class.

[Misiuggah]

Originally Posted by jauertussen jup god point. but agein a weak tank is not always a problem. if ppl play realy smart with other classes and support the tank, with coordinated buffs. like bs prot thing and necro prot ****, and agro pet. or sin taking agro and bubble or spec ure barb so he can offtank. and in the end if u play ure tank realy well skill can often compencede for gear in some situations. but then agein the guy with a undergeared tank issent the player with 2 years exp with hes class.

Experience works wonders - ubergear is just a cherry on top. Did a lot of runs as an undergeared tank, but with experienced and willing party - they used all skills to help me, dpsers were tanking etc.

The key is having friends who will let you do it. Everyone should understand that having an experienced and geared tank around is in their best interest.