It is a "game of life"; creating rules and then lean back and see how they evolve. The measure of success is, by necessity, the death rate, if the objective is to stimulate growth, but within any set of rules there is a population that is optimal and others that are less optimal. The Shrines of Bori match this very well.. the rules are nice, the idea is nice, but the success isn't a clever idea, it is lasting "Fun in a PvP area" (to not bring up the topic of whether actual fighting is necessary for PvP). This was introduced with the promise of rewards, but personally I realized I would not get them until the next tier was introduced and the requirements slacked, so I just wanted some fun, and a few tokens as recognition.
The population mechanic got in the way, though. Sure, any guild will go with six people to get optimal rewards - at the start. The moment they get real resistance, they will number up until that is no longer the case. The Zerg, in fact, always wins. That'd be fine if those who try got a little back, but realistically you can never take on a zerg with a smaller group and make a sacrifice. Many smaller groups could, but we never get there, because people dying to a zerg get nothing - no win, no fun fight, no reward.
Thus we get the facts of Bori; while people could stand up and make it work, they won't. Not because they have a crazy idea of fun, but because the mechanics of Bori encourage this behaviour among them. The theoretical design model may not, and has the best intentions, but it turns out it was not based on reality. I won't take "hey, it is your choice" for an answer why this is true, it is design applied to reality, and that's it.
I'd believe that what we need is ways to get A: fun (fights, probably) and B: rewards, EVEN while trying to beat the zerg. Sure, smaller, Bori is about domination, but nevertheless people will need a motivation to take up a fight against a zerg. Back in the days, you could sneak a kill and get some PvP-Xp, but this has no real bearing anymore. But we need something similar.
Personally, one change I'd consider is the option to make smaller sacrifices, i.e. when the altar is not full. That'd liven up the gameplay in two ways, first from giving the option to sneak some resources and make a sacrifice under the nose of a zerg, whose challenge is then to spread out and try to stop them, and second in that you can "pick a fight" with the zerg by these smaller sacrifices impeding the progress of the zerg (though not as much as a full sacrifice, obviously). The first offers the potential for reward for standing up to the zerg, the second makes it harder to uphold "gentleman's rules" or win by farming power alone.
I'd suggest a quadratic curve on the rewards, or something similar, but the fact is we'll get nowhere if we don't accept that system design affect player behaviour, and that a lot of us want to change the player behaviour.. since we get discouraged from doing that ourselves, we'd like the system to help us.
People want so many things but often do not realise those things cannot coexist. You cannot have open world pvp, no cap on guildmembers and then expect fair fights to happen. Yet changing one of these things is not what people want either (more instanced pvp? cap on guildmembers? nope).
Before 1.05 we had almost open world pvp all the damn time. Why? Cuz it was rewarding for even solo players to do it! Why? Cuz they could rush a crapp zerg and actually kill a dude if his team mates/your target didnt react fast enough. I should know. I lvled a barb and a demo back in the day`s based on solo world pvp.
In 1.06, with the increase of HP, solo pvp became pretty much useless, and u had to match the numbers more or less to be able to do world pvp.
And now in 1.07 we have Bori. Wich pretty much only disencourages world pvp. It cant even remotly be compared to the world pvp in Oasis we had at 1.06.. Which makes it how much worse than the world pvp back in 1.05?
I dont give a rats arse about fair games. Fighting is never fair. But Bori is simply a huge waste of time! And it Pisses me of when FC obviously dont understand this as they implent some **** gear which will undermine Bori even if they should be able to fix it.
Ok, Ilaliya and I have spoken a bit about this now, and this we think can be done. We will aim to introduce a new set without the requirements for Bori tokens, that is less powerful but will allow players the choice to seek out that set if they prefer the minigame / general PVP route.
It almost certainly won't make it into the update next week, but we will see if we can find a slot before the expansion for it (and worst case we will include it with the expansion release update)
Wonderfull!!!! Bori is soooo boring.... Great news!!!
Why the hell waste time on this when ya should use time on making Bori better content. This is one of the biggest damn problems in FC! Huge failure when it comes to understanding pvp mechanics. Listening to all the damn whine and implenting more and more crappy features wich will make AoC a even more crappy game.
Bori can be a great success if ya get your heads out of your arses and tweaks it to it works. Which ya with this certainly proves that ya dont intend to do. Jeez.. Stop listening to damn whine and start doin the ****ing right thing for once.
This will solve exactly NOTHING.
I read your posts and agree on some of the things you say...
It needs work, but giving people the option to choose is a good idea from funcom.
If they give us diffrent ways to gain the tokens, it is a step in the right direction.
However Bori needs ASAP tweaking, so i understand your frustration.